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We're a City of Heroes SuperGroup on the Triumph Server (#15 in earned prestige). We are always recruiting and are in it for the fun of the game and the thrill of a base raid! Send a message to @colder or @azrhiaz ingame with your email address to be added to this group.
24 comments:
Well, where to start? Defending was sure a lot easier. Which really is how it should be. This isn't supposed to be a 50/50 kind of thing where there is a good chance of success. If it were easy to nab an IoP from our base I would be pissed. That being said, I am sure we all have some choice comments about Dominators. It also seemed that they had a few stalkers with the sole goal to hammer the empaths. From personal experience I never lasted more than a minute inside their base before I got pounded. I tried the whole never stop moving, but the times I did that I was by myself in their base with no one around to heal. I got a couple of pylons down but that just didn't work so well either so it seems. All in all it was great, but something really needs to be done about dominators. With clear mind and a couple of break frees I was still being held. And what is the deal with being assassin struck when I was phased? That really stunk. We did as good as we could. One particular memory.... I put a regeneration aura, adrenalin boost, clear mind, recovery aura, and a fortitude on Amazing Man. He zoned in and I was right behind him. By the time I got there he was already dead. I couldn't believe it. I thought he would be a wrecking machine!! I almost turned my computer off, kicked the cat and went to bed!!!
Well first off, I'd like to congratulate ya'll on the raids. I think we did a good job and died with dignity on the return raid.
I don't really know the answer for the dominators. They cracked our tanks, and demolished our support. We were very short on damage. If I'd brought my blaster and Colder showed, would that have changed the tide? I don't know. A dead dom can't do shit, can they? I know on Test spiking is the way to go (IE: everyone focuses on one target). Also, once a team is broken, it's hard to get it back together. Especially the MMs! :)
The question we need to ask ourselves is: are we willing to develop strategies to vanquish our "foes" or are we only happy when we win? I know we got crushed on the attack, but hey, that's just part of the game. It was fairly simple on their side: hold the DBers, stalker finishes them off. How do we get around this? Spike the doms?
I imagine with more experience and a bit more balance in our team, we can overcome this. I think we should each pick one or two toons that we will use for raiding and use them exclusively. Unfortunately, Baba can't play his rad, his stone, and his new bubbler all the same time. So pick a toon you want to play and stick with it. Level it to 50 and IO it out. We can recruit the missing pieces as necessary.
Please know that our tank taunting drove them crazy. Ink Man said he was ready to pull his hair out! :) So thank you to Ebon, Amazing and Mercy for helping keep us squishies safe!
For the future, I'd love to have us recruit more stormies. The hurricane is a HUGE debuff and has a -range on it. If we hit a dom with 2-3 hurricanes, their range will be destroyed and they'll have to get right next to their target. Lightning storm and tornado are also monsters.
Impitude made a bubbler but another would be fun too. Some blasters would also be good.
From the sound of things it seemed like it was a tough battle. Good job to the crew...I know you all fought well and I wish I could have been there to add to some of the damage.
My main isn't really built for PVP/raiding but I'll be more than willing to build a toon up for those purposes.
*ahem there is a double xp weekend around the corner...
After going through the various AT's, I really like to dish out damage so are there any blaster/scrapper type toons the DB needs for raiding/pvping? Or maybe there's a way I can retro-fit/respec my main into competitive pvp form...although I don't think ice/ice is too high on the pvp uber list. I'm all ears gang!
P.S. Great job on the fusion gen guys!
Wow! I couldn't have asked for better input. Garl basically layed out the problem, Az came up with the viable solutions and Colder responded with undieing support.
First I would like to say that a turn out of 12-13 is absolutely fantastic and that there isn't any DBers that I wouldn't want to raid with.
Secondly they have adapted and we have not. our numbers are not going to do it when they have pvp specific builds and the experience with them. That is why they did so well on defending and we did so so. If it wasn't for Az's base designing prowess and having a fusion generator I'm afraid it would not have gone as well. Dom's are NOT invincible. I refuse to believe it. I have thought of many ways to counter them but it all boils down to having the right toons in play and a plan.
I'm off "work" so... to be continued lol.
oOOO oooOOO I just thought of something! CAGES!
Bubblers, sonics, dark, grav, they all have powers that render an opponent "only affecting self" If we cage those mother f-ers, they'll be useless!!! muah ha ha!!
I'll have to find out if domination protects them from cages, but hey now! What a yummy idea, eh?
I do have my illusion/storm. Is that build ideal for pvp/raiding?
Great idea Az. They definately bears looking into. As far as Doms go..., well..., I have my own opinions... and they aren't good.
When I've got unyeilding + unstoppable + 5 cm's + 2 bf's going and they cut through it like butter? Yeah..., I have major issues with that.
All in all though, I thought it went well considering. Amazingman is slowly being levelled up..., he's close to the group fear, I noticed Ebon went that route too.., perhaps this will help out with the Doms?
Anyway, definately looking forward to the next raid. Although RotA is a mighty tough group, they won't give us an inch, that is for sure.
Hey guys, sorry I missed the raid...well considering the outcry of Dom hate maybe not so sorry :P My next DBer coming up is a dark defender so I'll be more than happy to test out the cage and see what we can do. Plus it will be nice to get to fear them back for a change :D
Ideas for building a pvp toon can be found all over the boards. Check them out but be careful guys are always trying to mislead the novice pvper.
Now for some bad new. I finally realize why no one endorses tanks in pvp besides ice armor. trying to taunt the nessary guys in a sea of chaos and MM pets is impossible. Ice armor at least gives a slow aura to deal with squishies that are cronic kiters, slow everyone you touch with your aura and is +def based, a very easy stat to buff ( fort maxed to the gills with def buff).Coupled with some -acc? Well Doms can not hold what they can not hit. All that and they have a resistance to slow effects. All this being said other tanks simply lack effectiveness. I know Ebon did well in the attack since I could almost see the smoke coming out of the stalkers ears and the Doms looking around saying "who is terrorizing me with fear while I'm trying to kill this invuln tank" ;)
very satifying but no where near as effective as an Ice tank. Don't believe me? Check the boards. This being said I might consider respecing my Ice/storm troller for pvp (a very nasty combo with all the slow powers in it). He is already 50th so I just need to figure out the IO sets that will work for him.
I won't be putting Ebon away for good just saying that too many tanks can hurt our damage output. BTW Amazingman when you get epic powers get focused accuracy from energy mastery. While it is toggled I can see (and taunt) stalkers even while they are hidden due to the +perception that it gives. LOL I can still see ink man looking around for the insolent cur that has taunted him while he thinks know one can see him. I would also stand right in front of him and pretend I can't see him then BLAM, Taunt, terrorize, build up, energy transfer etc..
I would like to see an ice/armor tank on the raids. I know a certain SG member that has one up to 34 already *Deep cough*.
Awesome Ideas Az for stickin it to those Doms. Of course Ebon has a warm place in his heart for sonic trollers and defenders.
Whew. One last thing. I think the empaths in our group got overwhelmed way too fast. I'm going to look on the boards and see if I can find out a better way to protect them or a way they can protect themselves. I hate seeing empaths go down >:( I feel like I've failed them more than any other teammate.
Well Ebon, ice tanks are great, yes. But they have no repel protection. So TK and force bubbles will pin them to a wall quicker than you can say "Brrr" You on the other hand, *do have the protection.
Tanks are not used in PvP because they lack damage. Sure they are tough to kill but taunt auras do not work and with blasters jumping back and forth like jumping beans, you aren't going to get close enough to hit them. Base raids on the other hand, are a WHOLE different ball of wax. I wouldn't trade Ebon out, period. You'll drop pretty quick if Earl's the only one in there throwing taunts. Besides, you seem to like that role. :)
Empaths need an escape power. Period. They need to take the concealment pool and slot up phase shift.
Or in Garl's case (or any x/emp troller), he should take the ice epic for hibernate
Well, I did a pile of reading last night on the boards and one of the threads was about the best kind of controller in PvP. To sum it up they said that ice/rad or ice/storm or ice/ff. I already have an ice/rad troller that is
16th level. I really like the caging idea and I think it has a lot of merit. What you said about having a team broken is also very true. As Ebon put it when we were on the phone, "Trying to drown them in our dead carcasses just didn't seem to be working." Once our initial rush failed, we should have regrouped and went in again together. Good things for us to think of for the next one. Well, in my case, it will be the one after that as I will be out of town the weekend of the RoA raid.
I forgot to mention that it would be nice to be able to physically talk to one another as well. What do we need to do to get that going? I recall joining a chat channel on triumph that mentioned something about anyone being able to use their ventrillo. I'll check it out again.
All I'm saying about tanks is that an Ice tank, an invuln, and a stone tank would work better than 2 invulns and a stone. The only reason is this. Versitility. with an ice tank we get the slow and resistance to slow advantage on top of the benefits that stone and invuln give. With unstoppable on it takes a long time to kill an invuln and stone has basically carte blanche against all damage but psi. A tank that has resistance to slow is able to cause them grief. While a tank who isn't is easy to mire in syrup and deal with later. I remember being slowed a lot in that last raid and others as well.
btw Ebon does a pile of damage.I can one shot most minions 2 lvls higher than me. The problem in pvp is that it's melee and guys just run away before I can bring everything to bare on them.
Well, Deep is leveling one and Zero C is at 50.
I also set us up with a vent server last night, so stop reading my mind, darn you!
Host IP: 64.34.164.243
the Port: 3424
Password is same as before, but if you don't know it, hit me up for it
Yea I'm looking into setting Zero C up for some PvP...unfortunately there are a few things I have to figure out. While def is nice, it's random so without some resists too it becomes either awesome or truly crappy. I also need to reslot taunt for PvP and probably pick up some of the presence pool. I have ice slick for PvE and it works okay in PvP but only in rare situations. It does have a slow effect to it so I might keep that. The biggest downside is Zero is ice/ice which means my damage is horrible but my annoyance factore is off the chart :P If anyone has any suggestions I'm open for them. :D
OK work had me away, so a LOT to get caught up on.
1) The Raid. One major factor in our performance and theres is OUR ETHICS. AZ said, "Hey here is the spawn point, once we all learned it (DESPITE BEING 10 ft from the generator!), we layed off of them. When we hit them, it was, entyer zone, get TELEKINSIS into the back room where they were waiting and got ganked by PERMA doms. Metoid had it happen to him at least 5 or 6 times, as did I. --BOTTOM LINE....PvP is for all types, we had more sportsmanship and it held us back. The other team had one or two individuals that were gankers, only way to get around them, is to beat them.
On a side note...we had 3 pylons down, if we can just get this COORDINATED, I know we can get 5 down at the same time. We got SOOOO close to 4, then 5.
2) Team build. On the raid where we were attacking, I ditched my stone tank to see how my new build on my BS/Regen was going. Experiment resulted in me no longer liking BS/Regen in lvl 50 fights, in Sirens Call he does great, but in the raid he was horrible. In doing this, I took the Stone Tank meat shield/taunt spammer away from the team, and it hurt the team.
We need to have an effective and dynamic team build. We were too squishee with no counter to their evil, evil dom threats (and few are folks!, Dom nerfs coming one day, I really think so).
I have often felt our typical PvP crew is lacking in Offense, but we do well in Defense (a big part due everyone's efforts to get Az the resources to make a great base to defend). We had one or two heavy hitters but it just felt imbalanced in the attacks. Or at least lately it seemed so.
3) Make a PvP toon, and like Az says, learn to play it. When PvP was kicking off I remember having a discussion one day with Az and we both were like PvP was blah to us, we were new to it and seemed meh. Now, well, she rocks the house. Metoid is the same way, I need to get, my little twerp of a son to make a PvP toon on Triumph. (YOU READING THIS METOID!).
I have made 3 PvP toons thus far (that I stuck with), the stoner is coming along, I respec'd him with one goal in mind, STAND UPRIGHT AND TAUNT. He has his place, boring, but oh so effective. Just like the doms drove us nuts, I once was taunted to tears on a raid, and learned well when looking at my tank as a Raid Only build. The bs/regen I think his day had come and is now gone thanks to doms and IOS. Just dont dig Regen anymore. The new one, A Force Field/Psychic. I am PL'ing when I can, don't care about badges content etc. And YES, I have already max slotted CAGE. My goal, have two builds for the Raid, built for Raids. One role, taunter, other role, counter the evil doms with Cage, Telekinisis like powers with the vicious bubbles. The psychic attacks are quite nice to round him off.
As a SG, if we get a solid set, where we offer the holds, the damage and the buffs/debuffs, we will be awesome, BECAUSE, see point 1), ETHICS. We work GREAT as a team. When a task is given and we stay on target, we rock.
5) So in the end, I had 50% fun and 25% frustration and 25%, well, I guess call it learning at this last raid. I hate those doms, ut I love mine on our Villain Group. Az if you want to practice against villains, my wife and I said we are more than willing to help.
OK folks back to the debates and inputs, if you see Eduardo Foster on, that is me, and I take PLs like it is going out of style.
PS Colder, Ice/Energy Blaster. EVIL EVIL PvP toon. Comes with aim and build up and all those nasty one on one melee hits on NRG. Hold, Slow and -Recharge on Ice side. My son's Freedom ice/nrg blaster had 200 reputation in less than two months of casual pvp. He could two shot people after lvl 22.
Well the nice thing about your new def Baba is when you hit your epic set, you can take the one with TK in it! It also has a sleep to take out *their bubblers.
Keep in mind as a bubbler, you will be one of the first targets they go for, make sure you take the concealment pool thru phase shift so you can evade being killed!
You will notice a trend with our villain friends, they attack with their MMs and their stalkers and defend with their MMs and doms. I think knowing this, we can potentially use this against them.
And they always have a bunch of pick up people with them since they aren't as "big" as we are, so cut them a little slack with the "ethics" part. linksys (Dotenshi) and mtlevilcore (macconflicted) and everyman (Death by Squishy) are really some of the coolest cats out there and they are always trying to keep the team in hand. Believe me, I had to ask our team *plenty of times to get away from the spawn point.
Thank you for not referencing me specifically on that last post Az!! :) I thought I was getting better! I am working on a Ice/rad troller, and am really considering making an Ice/EM blaster for the damage. I am normally not a huge PL fan, but I am going to actively seek it out where I can. I agree that we were lacking in offence, but that is getting better I think. I am a casual player now (WAH!) so I would like some guidance from the rest of the SG on which of the two toons to run with.
Honestly, I think damage toons are the easiest to get but don't let me dissuade you if you think you would be happier playing that role. I enjoy it myself!
Again, it boils down to where your strengths are as a teammate. Some people are strong with support, others just want to run in guns blazing. So pick a toon that will allow you to have fun and play smart and enhance the team.
Do the trollers we choose not have to compliment one another? If so how many and what type would be valuable, but I am also up for the old test it out ourselves since this gains experience at the same time.
Baba I agree with all of what you said but I would like to just say that ethics did not play as much of a role. Az touched on why. Their very own tactics allowed us to set down 3 pylons before they knew it. Their method of kill,kill,KILL means they are distractable. It may work in the pvp zones but raids are different.
That being said. I would however like to see the victory/defeat ratio's change. I know setting down pylons is end game for attacking but it just feels better to take THEM down for a change. Not whole sale slaught just bring our total up a bit and decrease theirs. I think on the attack their top guy had something like 43 kills. A number I have never seen in a raid.
Anyway contact me in game anytime to assist in getting your raid toons up in lvls (radio mishes in PI are quick so they give mission xp faster). Ebon's build has made him even better pve than he was before. Or if anyone has an event they want to do such as MS raids for base raiders 35+.
We should set up a PL day during double XP weekend. I am out of town so don't think I can participate but others may benefit from it.
I can help level 35 plus in RWZ with Melqar (48) on someone else's level 50 missions. But that's they best I can do unless a spread works out with some lower level toons. I'm sure we can figure something out.
Just cuz i can, i would like to post a response from the villain side of things.
1- Doms are definately not invincible, ddoc fought the fallen one third recently, and the perma doms got ruined on both attacking teams. Spikin works, so do alot of -recharge.
2-Generally speaking the poor sportmanship comes from people we pick up last minute through friends to try and equal out your constantly high turnouts. OR people who are new to the raiding and pvp concept who don't quite get what a spawn is and are therefore unable to resist camping said spawn.
3- Caging doms is a quick fix to short term eliminate the dom threat. But it doesn't top them being perma'd nor does it eliminate them from the equation. I just recently lvld a grave dom. Correct me if i;m wrong but i think phasin opponents out has been nerfed, it doesn't last as long as it used to, so much so infact on my new dom that phase became a waste of a power.
4-Attacks always go worse than defense if the numbers are relatively even. Familiar ground an all.
I'm drunk, i;m not sure if i make sense or if maybe i sound to defensive. But we have raided at least a dozen different sg>vg"s on triumph< and you guys are by far the best
Great job on the base Az, hope you all are still happy to raid both the ddoc and the bandits. Canadians FTW. Please don't get out perma doms NERFED, its all we've got that could possible hope to contend with emps.blasters and tauting ^#*%*&$ tanks.
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